We are THRILLED to share this email interview with Enneagram teacher and Yoga therapist Abi Robins (they/them), author of The Conscious Enneagram: How to Move from Typology to Transformation.
In it, Abi invites us beyond the personality descriptions and into a living, breathing practice of embodiment, deconstruction, and emergence. Drawing from their training with The Narrative Enneagram and their work as a CIAYT Yoga Therapist, Abi weaves together the deep insight of the Enneagram with the grounding, integrative practices of Yoga Therapy.
With an approach that is both accessible and profoundly transformative, Abi helps us see the Enneagram not simply as a system for self-discovery, but as a companion on the journey toward becoming more fully ourselves.
Your book, “The Conscious Enneagram", speaks to integrating the Enneagram into our daily lives. How do you personally return to the Enneagram in a way that keeps it alive in your own body and relationships—not just your teaching?
I think the Enneagram is at its best when it is used, and really internalized. You asked “how do I return to the Enneagram?” but the reality is, at this point, it’s inside me. After years of study, application, and practice, the Enneagram is an integral framework that I see the world through.
I see myself and the world around me through this lens, and it is essentially second nature at this point. And it’s not that I’m trying to force the things I see into this framework, it’s much gentler than that. It’s as if the Enneagram is a program running in the background, you only really need to talk about it, if there’s a problem. Otherwise, stop talking about it, and just use it.
In your work as both a Yoga practitioner and Enneagram teacher, how do you see the body playing a role in sustainable transformation? What wisdom does the body offer that the mind often misses when engaging with the Enneagram?
First off, I love to remind people that we only exist in our bodies. Our minds live in our bodies. Our hearts live in our bodies. We do not exist outside of our bodies, if our bodies go, we go. The body is the foundation of our being, and if our mind is transforming, but our body stays the same, we are only creating a rift between our physical selves and our mental/emotional selves. The body is also the seat of our action. The mind does not take action. The heart does not take action. Only the body. And if we aren’t taking new action, can we really say that we’ve been transformed?
This is why I spend so much of my time teaching on practice and it’s importance on our personal and spiritual journeys. Wendell Berry once wrote: “A change of heart or of values without a practice is only another pointless luxury of a passively consumptive way of life.” And this is the kind of lifestyle we fall into when we divorce our hearts and minds from our bodies.
You write that the Enneagram won’t change us unless we know how to use it. What do you feel is the biggest misconception folks have when they first encounter the Enneagram, and how do you gently help them course correct?
Easily the biggest misconception I run into is that the enneagram is about figuring out your type. So many people believe knowing their type is the end of the road, but it is literally only the start. I often help people understand this by explaining the difference between taking a test and doing something like reading on your own or doing a typing interview. If knowing your type is the only outcome you want, it doesn’t matter how you get it, you just have to get it–in some sense, the ends justify the means–but if understanding your type is only a step in the process, then how you take that step matters a lot more. I do my best to encourage people to see the enneagram not as a test, but as a map that we must learn to read.
As someone who is expanding and deepening the Enneagram field, what’s your hope for how the next generation of spiritual seekers engages with this tool? What needs to be reimagined or remembered?
Two things come to mind immediately. First, that we take it less seriously. There is no hard and fast science of the Enneagram. On some level, it’s bullshit. AND THAT’S OKAY. Seeing the limitations of this tool and framework means that we can remain humble in our journeys with it. We don’t have to pin all of our hopes and dreams on it, we can just use it when it’s useful, and set it down when it’s not. The second thing is that you don’t really need to know that much about the enneagram to actually start using it.
You only need VERY LITTLE. Sure stuff is fun to talk about and theorize on, but if what we’re talking about isn’t actionable, it’s pointless. I’d love to see more people spend less time talking about the enneagram and all its many facets and more time putting it into practice.
What is one piece of advice You would give to someone who is just starting out on their journey with the enneagram?
There is no “one” enneagram journey, it could apply to any number of things you want to do with your life. Once you figure out where you want to use it, start practicing. Like immediately. Then build a relationship with a teacher you can trust, and finally be a part of a community of people who are on the same journey you are. If you do those things, your life will never be the same.
Where can we learn more about your work?
